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8.33 kHz radio upgrades

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8.33 kHz radio upgrades

Postby duncanlogan » Thu Feb 23, 2017 10:49 pm

Hello gents

Been spending abit of time looking at different options for upgrading my current microair m760.
Today I noticed that dittel do a plug in adapter that would fit the microair loom I have . So I wouldn't need to re wire anything, a simple plug and play and away you go.

Has any one had any experience with dittel radios, are they any good, reliability etc.

Cheers
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Re: 8.33 kHz radio upgrades

Postby Steevo » Fri Feb 24, 2017 5:30 pm

I have a Dittel in the hangar that I will be installing for someone in the next few weeks. I have tried it on the bench and it seems quite good. They seem to have fairly good reviews especially for the price.

One thing I will mention about adapters, although they work fine, some can introduce noise in to the audio system especially if your wiring is shielded. But they do save a whole lot of hassle if they work ok. There were adapters available when I upgraded mine (Trig TY91) but I decided just to rewire.
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Re: 8.33 kHz radio upgrades

Postby Sarum » Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:23 pm

Steevo or others,
Further to posts earlier in the year, has anyone operational experience of either the Dittel or Fukework ATR833 8.33 radios in a Jabiru aircraft, specifically a UL 450. A friend has a Dittel in a Tecnam aircraft & is only moderately satisfied with the performance.
Any reviews of alternative radios would also be welcomed.
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Re: 8.33 kHz radio upgrades

Postby Sarum » Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:14 pm

Steevo,
Earlier in the year you posted that you were installing a Dittel 8.33radio on behalf of a friend/client & would be interested to hear of your operational opinions of this radio, particularly if installed in a Jabiru. A friend feels its performance to be only adequate installed a different aircraft type. Any feedback on operational experience of other 8.33 radios in Jabiru aircraft would be much appreciated.

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Re: 8.33 kHz radio upgrades

Postby Steevo » Tue Sep 12, 2017 10:48 am

I have experienced both and a Trig.

I started with the Funke ATR833. It was a good radio. The only downside to it in a Jab is that it is very long and only just about fits a standard panel without hitting the back. But it is a very good radio. I only changed because I installed an EFIS system and that had native support for Trig radios and transponders. If it wasn't for that, I would have been really happy with the Funke.

The Trig I found a little bit lacking in a Jab. I have put them in 2 Jabs now and in both I had a hell of a job getting rid of all the interefernce (never got rid of it totally even using completely shielded cable and other interference suppressing devices). Another member on here also had the same problem with his Trig in a Jab. He approached Trig and they told him to send the radio to them as there was an update they could apply for Jab engines. He sent it back and they did it and I think it gave minor improvements but didn't fix the problem entirely. He may well see this and respond.

I currently have a Dittel (TQ Avionics) KRT2 in my Jab SPL-450 (UL-450). The radio on the whole I have been impressed with but do find that the firmware does have a few bugs. The performance is about the same as a Trig and does have a bigger screen than the Trig. It is also an all-in-one unit so you don't have to find a place to fit a remote box. You will either love or hate having a remote box.

I also installed the Dittel in a Samba with a Jab engine. They are more than pleased with it.

The advantages of the Trig is that manufacturer support is the best I have ever come across.
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Re: 8.33 kHz radio upgrades

Postby Sarum » Wed Sep 13, 2017 8:07 pm

Steevo,
Many thanks for your comprehensive reply to my query re 8.33 radio upgrades.
You have confirmed my thoughts that it comes down to the Dittel or Funkework. The Jab is not the best for space & fitting of a two part unit.
Can Funkework supply an adaptor plug & does this fit directly on to the back of the unit, which I assume would make the radio too long for the Jab?
I understand that Mendelssohn can make up adaptor plugs for the Dittel & possibly others. (I note your earlier comments of possible problems with such plugs but thought it would be worth a try to simplify installation).
Forgive my ignorance , but could you elaborate on the 'firmware' problems with the Dittel.
Many thanks for your advice.

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Re: 8.33 kHz radio upgrades

Postby Steevo » Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:58 am

For the Funkwerk in a standard Jab panel you just need a 90degree angle d-sub housing. You can buy a pre-made cable that has everything you need from Funke etc but I think they are expensive for what they are (little change out of £200) They also use snap-lock on the plugs but you can unscrew them and just replace them with standard d-sub posts which are about £3 from Maplins. Sourcing the snap-locks that actually fit is hard in the UK so I usually just remove them. The Dittel also uses snap-lock.

When you say adapter plug, do you mean one that converts from a different radio existing wiring to the Funke? Again, you can easily make these yourself. If pre-made then it would have to be a 90degree connector with a length of wire before the other connector for the old radio plug else you will run out of space behind the panel. This does depend on what Jab panel you have. If you have the 3 section Jab panel with the storage cupboard on the right, then the radio will fit in the middle section with a bit of space behind to spare but if you have the all-in-one panel then the connectors at the back will push against the firewall and if you don't use a 90degree connector on the Funke then the radio will not go all the way back. If you had a J160 or J430 then the panel is slightly deeper so no problem.

The other thing to consider is if you are going to use the in-built intercom or not. For the in-built intercom, for me, the Funke was the worst. It clicked loudly eveytime it activated or deavtivated. I have always used a seperate intercom. The Trig and Dittel have fairly good intercoms but still not as good as a standalone intercom. In my aircraft, everything is stereo so all runs from a seperate PS Engineering intercom although Sigtronics are excellent as well.

The Dittel firmware, I keep finding small things that don't work as expected. Things like the sidetone. I have to have the sidetone on max volume but sometimes it seems quiet. If I go into the menu and change it from max to 9 and then back to max, then it goes to loud again. This has happened on both the Dittels a number of times.

The last thing to consider is weight. The Funke is heavy compared to the Dittel or Trig. It's only grammes, but if you are trying to save on weight then it's a consideration.

The other thing is if you want to use the audio input for external devices like PilotAware or music etc. The Funke has a pre-amp built in that is more powerful than the other 2 radios. Something like PilotAware puts out a very low volume and connected to the Trig or Dittel, it is impossible to get an acceptable volume without putting in some sort of pre-amp between them. The Funke has an acceptable volume level just connected directly.

As for performance, I can honestly say that I have noticed no difference between all 3 of these radios. For the Radios I have dealt with on my own and other people's aircraft, this has always been down to the antenna, cable and SWR. The standard Jab antenna is just a strip of aluminium in the tail which is about as basic as an antenna can be. The SWR on a Jab is usually just about adequate or in a lot of case at dangerous levels (above 3). I replaced my antenna with a Bob Archer model 6 which is installed in the tail cone. That brought a noticeable improvement.

Taking cost in to consideration, I would probably go for a Dittel if I was doing it again. In a Jab, I would rule out Trig but would be perfectly happy with a Funke.
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Re: 8.33 kHz radio upgrades

Postby Sarum » Fri Sep 15, 2017 9:42 am

Steevo,
Many thanks again - all very useful information.
As you guessed, I hoped to fit an interface plug between any new radio & the existing plug on the end of the wiring loom in my plane.
As I thought the distance between the panel & the fire wall is critical particularly, as you mention, I have the flat panel. Unfortunately I am not able to heck that at present as my Jab is under repair following an electrical fire resulting from the solenoid welding itself in the 'ON' position when starting. Be warned if your Jab is wired according to the diagram in the manual there is no protection fitted to prevent this occurrence.
On balance it would appear the Dittel to be the best bet but may need a 90 degree plug in addition to a conversion plug/
lead.

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Re: 8.33 kHz radio upgrades

Postby duncanlogan » Wed Apr 04, 2018 3:50 pm

JUst incase any one was interested I finally decided to purchase the TQ avionics formely Dittel KRT2 ,

I am extremely happy with the results. Any slight interference I used to have with my Microair, is now completely gone with the KRT2

I would highly recommend the KRT2 to anyone that is looking to upgrade there radio to the 8.33khz compliance in the uk. :D
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Re: 8.33 kHz radio upgrades

Postby Steve » Thu Apr 05, 2018 1:10 pm

They are a good radio, especially for the price. I would have liked their transponder but currently they are not ADSB compliant as far as the SIL and SDA are concerned. They did tell me that a firmware update was being made available in the first quarter of this year to make it UK ADSB compliant (uncertified GPS) but so far I have not heard anything.
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